Richard Rowntree, managing director for mortgages at Paragon Bank, opened the session to discuss the progress of the socio-mobility government taskforce and establishment of the socioeconomic diversity membership body Progress Together.
He said there had not been a “wake up moment” for the barriers faced by people from a working class background, in the same ways the Black Lives Matter and Me Too movements raised awareness around discrimination faced by black people and women.
Rowntree said it was also difficult to determine people who were raised working class as they sometimes did not want to discuss it. He also noted that some people’s progression in life could mask any barriers they may have faced during their upbringing.
He said one of the questions used to figure out someone’s socioeconomic background is to ask what jobs their parents did when they were 14, but Rowntree said that “didn’t tell the whole story”.
Using himself as an example, Rowntree said by the time he was that age, his dad who worked various blue collar jobs had “blagged himself into Reuters on a two month short-term contract” and built up a successful career.
He added: “If you look at me technically on that question, I would look like I come from a professional background, but far from it. I grew up on a council estate, and went to a very tricky comprehensive school.
“I was the first person in my family to get a degree, my mum’s German so I’m a second generation immigrant.”
Background a key determiner of life progression
Rowntree said a person’s background was the biggest determining factor of where they would end up in life.
He said the data backed this up as people from working class backgrounds progressed in their careers 25 per cent slower than their counterparts, but it was real life stories which brought this to life and made people pay attention.
Rowntree said when he shared his background at last year’s DIFF, he was nervous due to the stigma attached to socioeconomic status and the tendency to conform to the dominant culture of the financial services sector.
He said the aim of the Progress Together organisation was to widen access into sector. Rowntree said according to data from The Bridge Group collated in 2020, 52 per cent of CEOs in the UK had a professional background but within financial services, that number rose to 89 per cent.
Rowntree said this was even more prevalent when considering intersectionality, which is when a person has multiple characteristics which may open them up to various forms of discrimination or barriers.
He said 45 per cent of white men with professional backgrounds working in financial services were in senior positions, while women from ethnic minority groups made up only one per cent.
He added: “Think about how much anger that one per cent causes when we talk about wealth inequality in this country. When we talk about this in the same way, we’ve just raised the conversation to another level.
“You’re not going to change that by tinkering around the edges, this needs fundamental change… with action, not with words.”
Rowntree said Progress Together wanted to ensure 50 per cent of all senior management in the UK come from a non-professional background. He said this could be achieved by firms in the sector working together to recruit more people from working class backgrounds and helping them progress in their careers.
Limiting progress
Rowntree also spoke of how people could see their career progression hindered by their employer, which could have a knock-on effect on diversity and inclusion efforts.
He said firms were often “protective of their own talent” and did not want employees to move around the business, which is something that can open people up to new opportunities.
He said: “And that’s within our own firms. So across the industry, this piece on why people settle in their role and don’t move – it’s because they may not have the network or opportunity to be out there.
“Understand there’s a whole world of opportunity out there outside of your organisation.”
Rowntree also said the days of working at a company “from cradle to grave” were no more.
Making people comfortable
Rowntree’s session was followed by a discussion which he chaired.
Rob Gill, managing director of Altura Mortgage Finance, Rupi Hunjan, managing director of Censeo Financial, Chloe Timperley, senior policy adviser at Association of Mortgage Intermediaries (AMI), Amanda Bryden, head of Halifax Intermediaries and Scottish Widows Bank, Martese Carton, director of distribution at Leeds Building Society and Rachel Geddes, founder and owner of Global Mortgage Management were on the panel.
Rowntree asked how companies could make people from working class backgrounds feel comfortable to be themselves at work and not conform.
From the audience, Kate Davies, executive director of IMLA, said some people did not realise when they were doing well at work, so giving praise and feedback could help create an environment where people feel validated.
Bryden said this was good, but an organisation where it felt safe to be corrected was just as important.
“If you’ve got the right culture, you’ll have an environment where it’s okay to make mistakes as well,” Bryden added.
Martin Schultheiss, group managing director of Uinsure, said one tip he had picked up from a lender was to get each new recruit to speak and spend time with senior members of staff. He said this could also potentially “spark something in them” which could result in career progression down the line.
Beverley Loggia, business partner at Lifetime Wealth Management, noted that gathering feedback from staff as a form of reverse mentoring helped to create a work environment that suited everyone. Tom Davies, managing director of Alexander Hall, agreed and said it was useful to go back to basics as, historically, when it came to mortgage advice, people would progress in their careers due to their sales performance and gain no leadership training.
Davies said business leaders needed a plan of what they wanted senior management to look like and needed to consider the skillsets which fit this.
Andrew Montlake, managing director of Coreco, said he “wore his heart on his sleeve” and said a workplace where people could be vulnerable was important.
He added: “It’s about being human. And if you can espouse that and empathise and seek it out in others, I think that shows you’re going to train the leaders of the future in a lot better way.”
Building confidence
Martese Carton from Leeds Building Society, questioned whether it was right to ask people to change themselves to fit a role or if it was better to teach people to be confident about themselves and embrace their differences.
She said entering a job interview with confidence could override any perceived barriers.
Carton added: “It is the confidence and belief in yourself, that you can do the role that will convince whoever you’re speaking to that there is something there.”
She asked how to give people confidence and prevent them from limiting themselves.
Gill said he recently met with a young black man from south London who was nervous about interacting with the white, middle class men he had to speak to for his sales role. Gill said he spent the next month or two introducing the man to people who fit that description to make him feel more comfortable.
Bryden said coming from Skegness to London, she did not always feel polished and tried to fit in, but as she went further in her career and established herself she felt more comfortable being authentic.
She also thanked others in the industry such as Esther Dijkstra, managing director, intermediaries at Lloyds Banking Group and Rob Sinclair, chief executive of AMI for encouraging her to be herself.
Bryden said: “I’m not quite as polished as some people, but that’s okay because I’ve got a support network around me saying, ‘we like you’.
“That’s the power of the people in this room. And we just need to make sure that we do more than keep them in this room and make sure we are helping to trickle that down the line and across to our peers.”
Five key takeaways
- People from various minority groups can face multiple barriers
- Creating an environment at work where employees can be themselves brings out the best in people
- Being protective over talented employees can limit their progress and hinder D&I efforts
- Approaching a job interview or role with confidence can override any perceived disadvantages
- The Progress Together body wants firms in the sector to work towards 50 per cent of leaders being from non-professional backgrounds.
